From: Automatic digest processor To: Recipients of SOMMS digests Subject: SOMMS Digest - 3 Sep 1999 to 4 Sep 1999 Date: Saturday, September 04, 1999 2:01 AM There are 16 messages totalling 671 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Getting mad..... (3) 2. new pic 3. Grunge # 3 hmmm (4) 4. Such a shame! (2) 5. DC Gathering... 6. video (2) 7. new video now 8. Watch the Video Now!!!! 9. CCM Video To UNSUBSCRIBE from SOMMS, send email to LISTSERV@MITVMA.MIT.EDU with the following in the body of your message: SIGNOFF SOMMS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 16:58:46 +1200 From: Adrian Humphrey Subject: Getting mad..... On a different note.... Does anyone else find that SU is really good to listen to when you're angry?? I find that if I set it running and let it play through, I've totally mellowed out by the end. Its great. Of course it could just be that I'm insane... Adrian. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 16:03:08 +0800 From: Raven Nation Subject: Re: new pic hej, <<< this thing is freaky!! what'st he deal with the cat and the window reflection? anyone know where this was taken?? >>> isn't this the album photo that vicky mentioned? the one that was on the EM copy shown to them during the charity auction lunch... - killyrbf http://noone.tsx.org ' a fallen angel is still an angel ' --- killyrbf ***** Tagline 98 - V 1.1.29 Beta for MDaemon 2.7 ***** No need to pay your ISP. ***** Tagline 98 - V 1.1.29 Beta for MDaemon 2.7 ***** Free Dial-Up Connection and E-Mail Address http://teammail.dynip.com:8082 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 05:33:14 -0700 From: "J.C." Subject: Re: Grunge # 3 hmmm Since when was BMF grunge? It sounds more like metal to me. Do you think when they made it the guy's were thinking "let's make it a grunge album", or more likely were they thinking "let's make a freaky heavy metal album"? Isn't grunge just a word that was dreamt up to make the heavy rock bands of the early nineties more socially acceptable because metal wasn't cool enough? If there is really such a thing as grunge, then it is defined by Nirvana. Soundgarden and Nirvana don't really have anything in common other than Seattle. If SG weren't from Seattle do you think they'd get called grunge? Soundgarden aren't the 3rd best grunge band, or the first best or whatever. In my humble opinion they were NEVER a grunge band. Never mind what album you might wanna point out. I don't know how you can decide that Badmotorfinger is grunge but Superunknown and Down on the Upside aren't. Surely none of them are. What does grunge mean to you? If we're talking about 1991, then I personally think that Badmotorfinger has a lot more in common with Metallica's Black album than with Nirvana's Nevermind (it's better than both of course). Jay p.s. Sorry about the slightly aggressive nature of this post, no flaming intended to be directed at you, it's just how it came out. Soundgarden being labled as grunge has been something that has long bugged me. --- Joe Franks wrote: > That is true to a certain degree. Since > Badmotorfinger was SG's last grunge > album. When they broke out the so called Grunge era > thats when they really > became popular. I love BMF, LTL, and UMOK but I > belive they found there > true style w/ SU and DOTU. Since BMF only came in > 32nd (somewhere around > there) they are technically in 3rd. Its just the > hard core fans like me and > the list that put them in first. > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at > http://www.hotmail.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 06:01:10 PDT From: Monnica Lewis Subject: Re: Getting mad..... >From: Adrian Humphrey >Reply-To: Adrian Humphrey >To: SOMMS@MITVMA.MIT.EDU >Subject: Getting mad..... >Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 16:58:46 +1200 > >On a different note.... > >Does anyone else find that SU is really good to listen to when you're >angry?? >I find that if I set it running and let it play through, I've totally >mellowed out by the end. Its great. >Of course it could just be that I'm insane... > >Adrian. I agree. Most of SG's albums have that affect on me too. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 09:05:43 +0800 From: dream sister Subject: Re: Such a shame! At Thu, 2 Sep 1999 19:04:47 +0200 Marco wrote: >It's shame!!! The official website can't tell us Chris' Europeen >dates!!! what do you think an official website is made for >I don't know if and eventually when Chris will play in Italy!!! I know >there are some Europeen dates, but they're not completely listed. I'm not the biggest fan of the official site, but it's not entirely their fault. Management and record companies don't tend to release tour dates, unless the entire tour (in this case the European one) is *completely* confirmed. There are still some gaps in the touring schedule with dates being added, and even the confirmed shows are still undergoing changes (they've just changed the venues for 2 of the German shows). Oh, and speaking of Germany; for those who think that Chris just isn't touring that country enough ;-) guess what? he's just added a 6th date (Munich). :-P nothing like an Octoberfest I guess... ds ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 06:12:30 PDT From: Monnica Lewis Subject: Re: Grunge # 3 hmmm "Grunge", like any other label people assign to things, is just a quick, convenient way to organize and describe things. To me, when someone says "grunge" it means "the group of rock bands that all happened to come from the Seattle area in the early 90's and had a sound that was quite different from top 40 pop or heavy metal" , it's much easier to say grunge. Which by default, would include SG, PJ, AIC, Nirvana, Mudhoney, Tad, yadda yadda yadda. Anyone who has spent any time listening to two or more of these bands know that they don't sound alike. As far as this band or that being number whatever on a list... well, people like lists too. I think it's a symptom of some deep-seeded psychological need for order in a chaotic world. My two cents. Monnica >From: "J.C." >Reply-To: "J.C." >To: SOMMS@MITVMA.MIT.EDU >Subject: Re: Grunge # 3 hmmm >Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 05:33:14 -0700 > >Since when was BMF grunge? It sounds more like metal >to me. Do you think when they made it the guy's were >thinking "let's make it a grunge album", or more >likely were they thinking "let's make a freaky heavy >metal album"? Isn't grunge just a word that was >dreamt up to make the heavy rock bands of the early >nineties more socially acceptable because metal wasn't >cool enough? > >If there is really such a thing as grunge, then it is >defined by Nirvana. Soundgarden and Nirvana don't >really have anything in common other than Seattle. If >SG weren't from Seattle do you think they'd get called >grunge? > >Soundgarden aren't the 3rd best grunge band, or the >first best or whatever. In my humble opinion they >were NEVER a grunge band. Never mind what album you >might wanna point out. I don't know how you can >decide that Badmotorfinger is grunge but Superunknown >and Down on the Upside aren't. Surely none of them >are. What does grunge mean to you? > >If we're talking about 1991, then I personally think >that Badmotorfinger has a lot more in common with >Metallica's Black album than with Nirvana's Nevermind >(it's better than both of course). > >Jay > >p.s. Sorry about the slightly aggressive nature of >this post, no flaming intended to be directed at you, >it's just how it came out. Soundgarden being labled >as grunge has been something that has long bugged me. > > > > >--- Joe Franks wrote: > > That is true to a certain degree. Since > > Badmotorfinger was SG's last grunge > > album. When they broke out the so called Grunge era > > thats when they really > > became popular. I love BMF, LTL, and UMOK but I > > belive they found there > > true style w/ SU and DOTU. Since BMF only came in > > 32nd (somewhere around > > there) they are technically in 3rd. Its just the > > hard core fans like me and > > the list that put them in first. > > > > >______________________________________________________ > > Get Your Private, Free Email at > > http://www.hotmail.com > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 08:48:42 -0500 From: tonerkin Subject: Re: Such a shame! At 10:30 PM 9/2/99 +0200, marta wrote:=20 >I consider Deb=B4s site as the official Chris Cornell site... I agree with you Marta. The Great and Magnificent Webmistress UKDeb has a fine site...... due not only to her exceptional skills BUTT the help of lots of Chris fans from all over the world. I hope Chris checks it out: http://www.rustycage.u-net.com/home.htm as does his "manager" to see what kind of great and loyal fans Chris has. And for you going to the DC show. UKDeb will be there...look for the lady with a british accent, a tiara made of bent flatware and a tee shirt that says ....I AM THE QUEEN!!! I will be the short dumpy one in a tee with an arrow pointing that says...."I'm with the Queen!" Candy will be the one with the tee that says.."BUTT I'm the Queen of the Okies". Jamie's will say, "I am the Queen Mom" And Stacy's will say..."I am NOT a Queen" We'll be easy to find I think! toni=20 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 09:55:42 -0400 From: Jamie Simpson Subject: DC Gathering... I'm building a list of people coming to the DC show on Sept. 17th. So far I have about 15 or so people that will be here. Let me know if you want notify about getting together. Send responses to me at: jsimpson@mitre.org Jamie (SOMMs Mom) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 10:00:06 PDT From: Ryan Gilbert Subject: Re: Getting mad..... >Does anyone else find that SU is really good to listen to when you're >angry?? >I find that if I set it running and let it play through, I've totally >mellowed out by the end. Its great. >Of course it could just be that I'm insane... I feel that way too. BMF does more for me when I'm angry though. Usually I calm down after listening to Slaves and Bulldozers. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 15:39:00 EDT From: andy gorlich Subject: video hey, i just saw the advertizment for him being on making the video. its freaky -andy ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 16:03:53 EDT From: Robin Warren Subject: Re: video and why would that be.........? Robin ! -------------------- In a message dated 9/3/99 12:41:29 PM Pacific Daylight Time, dragnbalg@HOTMAIL.COM writes: > hey, i just saw the advertizment for him being on making the video. its > freaky > -andy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 09:34:07 +1000 From: Mansel Ismay Subject: Re: Grunge # 3 hmmm Since when was SG part of a category? (WEll, everything is, bt I'll get to that later). If in 1989 you heard Louder than Love, or even UMOK or Screaming Life, and someone asked you to categorise it, you wouldn't have a clue. All this shit coming from Seattle was different. It was way better than punk, it was kinda like punk rock and was ALMOST metal. But no way was it actually any of those. And as far as categorising BMF as metal, wha? I don't think SG went into any album thinking "let's make a album". To my knowledge, they just went in, and made up their songs, and that's it. I don't believe the way they wrote their songs is like metal, alot of Metal bands were classified as 'middle class pretty boys' because they would go out and get a whole shitload of equipment (Keyboards, massive expensive basses, etc... as one guy in hype! said.. "It was too much sound" (The guy with the british accent)) and wear all funny clothes, and then write songs in specific keys, and proper time signatures, and that is why you could classify it. It was all the same, too much sound, all well trained boys playing their key signatures with big axes. No way did SG EVER play to a specific key, at least before SU. And as for time signatures, well, we all know Matt as being master of the odd time signature. It's hard to describe how "un-Metal" SG are, and any other Seattle band branded that way. You see, what happened in Seattle was, not a "blind labelling" of a band to Grunge (Well, in some media cases, unfortunately, yes) but an easy categorisation and reference point. Each band from Seattle had pretty much similar roots, and all their sounds were quite similar (I remember reading an article where Chris is talking about a chord progression he was going to use, but then Kurt Cobain used it in one of his songs) but their were noticeable differences, and especially towards the end (94-96) of the whole hype, SG changed dramatically. The fact that they were making up awesome music that no one had ever heard before qualified them in that category. "Grunge" is a category given to bands pretty much who do not fit into the punk, punk rock, metal, or rock scene (But come close in each). My two cents. -Mansel -----Original Message----- From: J.C. To: SOMMS@MITVMA.MIT.EDU Date: Friday, September 03, 1999 10:30 PM Subject: Re: Grunge # 3 hmmm >Since when was BMF grunge? It sounds more like metal >to me. Do you think when they made it the guy's were >thinking "let's make it a grunge album", or more >likely were they thinking "let's make a freaky heavy >metal album"? Isn't grunge just a word that was >dreamt up to make the heavy rock bands of the early >nineties more socially acceptable because metal wasn't >cool enough? > >If there is really such a thing as grunge, then it is >defined by Nirvana. Soundgarden and Nirvana don't >really have anything in common other than Seattle. If >SG weren't from Seattle do you think they'd get called >grunge? > >Soundgarden aren't the 3rd best grunge band, or the >first best or whatever. In my humble opinion they >were NEVER a grunge band. Never mind what album you >might wanna point out. I don't know how you can >decide that Badmotorfinger is grunge but Superunknown >and Down on the Upside aren't. Surely none of them >are. What does grunge mean to you? > >If we're talking about 1991, then I personally think >that Badmotorfinger has a lot more in common with >Metallica's Black album than with Nirvana's Nevermind >(it's better than both of course). > >Jay > >p.s. Sorry about the slightly aggressive nature of >this post, no flaming intended to be directed at you, >it's just how it came out. Soundgarden being labled >as grunge has been something that has long bugged me. > > > > >--- Joe Franks wrote: >> That is true to a certain degree. Since >> Badmotorfinger was SG's last grunge >> album. When they broke out the so called Grunge era >> thats when they really >> became popular. I love BMF, LTL, and UMOK but I >> belive they found there >> true style w/ SU and DOTU. Since BMF only came in >> 32nd (somewhere around >> there) they are technically in 3rd. Its just the >> hard core fans like me and >> the list that put them in first. >> >> >______________________________________________________ >> Get Your Private, Free Email at >> http://www.hotmail.com >> > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 19:47:56 -0700 From: Amber Subject: new video now the new video is on the official site... chris on fire in the jcp..thank you...there is a god.... amber ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 18:54:15 -0700 From: "J.C." Subject: Re: Grunge # 3 hmmm > And as far as categorising > BMF as metal, wha? > I don't think SG went into any album thinking "let's > make a needed to be ridiculed> album". To my knowledge, > they just went in, and made > up their songs, and that's it. That exact reasoning is of course why the word grunge was made up in the first place. To me the definition of heavy metal is pretty simple, and it's one virtually all of the big Seattle bands fit comfortably into. It's simply guitar rock with a heavy emphasise on loud guitar riffs. When the phrase 'heavy metal' first begun getting bandied about about it was to describe people like Jimi Hendrix, Led Zepplin, Black Sabbath and AC/DC wasn't it? That is heavy metal to me. Of course in the eighties metal sort of went on a divergence to one corner with the Metallica inspired black t-shirt wearing thrash metallers and in the other with the Van Halen and Kiss inspired hair metallers. Then thank god we had the Seattle led revolution. I don't see the type of music that Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, Nirvana, Alice in Chains, or outside Seattle with bands like The Pumpkins and Tool, as a birth of a new musical style. I see it only as the triumphant return of heavy metal from the creative doldrums. To me, all these bands are simply the natural progression from the bands of the seventies (both metal and punk) mostly ignoring everything that went on in the eighties. It is metal. What's the big deal with that? It's not a dirty word you know. > It was all > the same, too much sound, > all well trained boys playing their key signatures > with big axes. No way did > SG EVER play to a specific key, at least before SU. > And as for time > signatures, well, we all know Matt as being master > of the odd time > signature. But don't you see. That wasn't Soundgarden being 'un-metal' as you put it. All the creative stuff that they did was in fact evolving metal, lifting it from the stagnation that we all know it was in. Metal as a musical form has so many possibilities, Soundgarden were perhaps the first band to begin exploring them again. I feel that they and others have not created a new music called grunge, rather they have lifted heavy metal to a new plateau. It may have simply been that intelligent people started playing heavy metal again. > You see, what happened in Seattle was,not a > "blind labelling" of a band to Grunge (Well, in some > media cases, unfortunately, yes) but an easy > categorisation and reference point. Is that what it was? Bands like Creed and Offspring etc. now get called grunge. I guess that in a way grunge has become it's own entity. It's evolved into the boring bland radio rock we get today. I still believe that the word grunge was just invented as a socially acceptable form of heavy metal though. Example. I remember playing a tape at school by Stone Temple Pilots when they were just new. Someone came up and asked me if they were metal or grunge. I'm thinking like, your listening to it, what do you think? I said they were grunge, and the person went away a STP fan. If I'd said they were metal (which really they were, this was the Core album) then the person would have instantly hated them, because metal isn't cool. Man, I have now completely forgotten my original point! Jay. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 20:49:41 PDT From: Joe Franks Subject: Watch the Video Now!!!! The video is on Chris' site. Really weird. Chris' sings like this is a heavier song than it is in some points. I like the video but I think its because I like Chris' music. So I don't know see what ya think. -Chris ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 15:26:22 +1000 From: Mansel Ismay Subject: CCM Video This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BEF6E9.D84A1860 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just saw the video, of course, RealPlayer was working about as fast as a = man with no limbs, but I got the jist. Was anyone else's reaction to the video, "What the Fuck?" heh, The fire is pretty cool though. -Mansel ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BEF6E9.D84A1860 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just saw the video, of course, = RealPlayer was=20 working about as fast as a man with no limbs, but I got the = jist.
 
Was anyone else's reaction to the = video,=20 "What the Fuck?"
 
heh, The fire is pretty cool=20 though.
 
-Mansel
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